Break the Matrix

I understand the theory that once you advance the maxilla up and forward, the mandible swings up to meet it, and it has been suggested that once you expand the upper arch, the lower arch is able to expand automatically. What I'm wondering is if this is actually true in practice or if protracting and expanding the maxilla can cause a malocclusion. I was watching "The President Show" on Comedy Central and Carole Radziwill was a guest (photo: http://www.allaboutthetea.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/The-Real-Housewives-of-New-York-City-Photos-Recap-Ramona-a-Banquet-and-Some-Issues.clipular-2.jpg). I admired her prominent zygomas, cheek hollows, wide upper arch, and facial convexity. However, her upper arch clearly protrudes beyond her lower arch. Is there a chance efforts to expand and protract the maxilla could achieve the kind of results we see in her midface, but also cause this kind of malocclusion? It seems logical that a protraction headgear could cause an overjet if conventional orthodontics use a retraction headgear to correct an overjet. 

I'm on board with what you're saying, the dentist has the same philosophy 99% of what I'm looking for.

However, Mike Mew says he tries to expand ~1mm per week in adults, saying that this rate of change (or near it) is not only fully possible but best for transferring the force through the entire skull so all bones (like cheekbones and upper maxilla) will grow and shift during the expansion.

The dentists I have consulted who subscribe to adult palate expansion (anywhere) don't do this rate,  they do it very slowly to so that you only come in once a month and they can monitor a bunch of cases slowly over time. This causes (according to theories) the aloveor process to be re-shaped by the local force but isn't enough force/time (ie impulse in physics) to travel to a wider area and cause growth at multiple skull sutures.

That is to say, they push hard and slow enough to cause the mouth to respond, but not enough to cause the entire skull to respond along with it

It sounds like you've really thought this through. I think orthodontists sometimes make adjustments to the wires on the expander to try and align the teeth as the arch expands and sometimes grind down some of the acrylic as the palate becomes less vaulted. Asdfasdf123's old thread seems to have been removed where he reported that the "amateur" expander maxes out around 8mm. I wonder if the appliances you would get from an orthodontist would offer more expansion. I suppose if you needed more you could always order a second expander with new impressions, but the lag time between finishing the first round of expansion and starting a second might be an issue. Did the orthodontist you consulted with say anything about expanding the bottom arch? My bottom teeth seem to be tilted inward a bit in the back and have some crowding in the front. I feel like a bottom expander might be helpful for me, but others have suggested that the bottom will adjust on its own after the top is expanded. Anyway, good luck if you decide to proceed with self-treatment, and please let us know how it goes! 

I just got done the consultation. He says the ALF isn't enough force for me right now, he can finish with it but he needs to start with an acrylic expander.

And it'll take ~2 years. I think I'm just going to buy an expander

Of course, the day I find this out is the day that BracesShop stops taking orders until July 27. Can you believe that luck? I suppose I'll just wait, unless anyone knows an alternative to that website

If you found an ortho who's willing to oversee your treatment, why not get the acrylic expander from him?

thank you for offering to help me To be honest, I have no idea if I got past the turbinates or not. my last attempt did gag me slightly but, like I said it hurt me last time so I've not done it since.
But I will try it again soon my right nostril is all locked up and I can barely get the finger cot up there. I think my maxilla is less developed on that side as my right eye is slightly more sunken that my left.

My guess is that you were only inflating within the meatus or back into the vestibule, and the finger cot never advanced past the turbinates into the nasopharynx. Generally, after careful placement of the finger cot, I give the sphygmomanometer bulb a few small squeezes while pressing inward and then feel the finger cot expand into the space of the nasopharynx where there is much less resistance as I squeeze fully a few times before releasing the valve and pulling the finger cot out.

I feel this exercise in the muscles on the back of my head at the top of my neck. It is as though tucking my chin and squishing the gum by pushing up with my tongue, especially the posterior 1/3 of my tongue, is opposed by these muscles at the back of my head which might typically be contracted in a forward head posture.

At least here in Finland every regular grocery store sells full xylitol gum with nothing else added.

Sugar alcohols are also often used as the sweeteners in gum in the US because they have been show to inhibit the growth of cavity-causing bacteria and because we can't digest them so they are calorie-free. That means, however, they are a FODMAP, passing unabsorbed into the colon and could impact the balance of gut flora.

I would really like some advice on self NCR, I would really like to have another go at it. do you have any tips?

Do you think the finger cot was inflating within the nasopharynx or were you not able to advance past the turbinates and just inflating within a meatus? It definitely took me several attempts to reach the nasopharynx when I was first learning. Even when I started treating again, I couldn't quite get it right on the first couple tries. For me, it is easiest to place the finger cot in the bottom meatus. Once you know where your target is and how it's supposed to feel it gets much easier. I'm happy to try and answer questions.