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Topic Summary

Posted by: PaperBag
« on: March 27, 2018, 01:23:06 am »

Bumping this thread because I've been obsessing about facepulling for days, specifically the Crane.
That before and after of the girl in front of the blue background is a patient of someone else, and she had surgeries that are unrelated to the concept of facepulling. http://drrichardjoseph.com/photos/112.php
What's the point of displaying someone who doesn't reflect the product being advertised?

Is the blonde girl up top the same person as the blonde woman on the bottom? I thought the photos were unrelated, but the whole website looks like something from 1998 so it's hard to tell and it makes what sounds like a good invention look very amateur when presented in such a clunky manner with little information to see.
Posted by: slamo28
« on: May 07, 2017, 11:43:24 am »

Actually there are before and after. .. and I'm really shocked
http://www.thecranencrp.com/
There is the girl with severe lack of midface.. and the pic on the right is crazingly different

I am so skeptical of this before and after photo. Looks like a double jaw surgery to me.
Posted by: Tyler
« on: May 07, 2017, 12:40:41 am »

That's great, thanks for sharing.

I still have my braces atm ... I will get around to getting them off, and getting one of those funny expander things in.
Posted by: Dr Jesse Jutkowitz
« on: May 05, 2017, 11:02:39 am »

This is a repeat from another thread but appropriate here.

You should check the thread on handling bodies.

Jaw problems are often not just the head or even in the head at all.  It is much more than that.

 check MeningealRelease.com

You can learn ABC™ yourself with a friend and save your body as well as time and money rather than paying someone who cannot do as much.

As I state in the video, the front view is useless, it is the side view that is most important and if you go to MeningealRelease.com   ,   sign up and learn the ABC First Rib Maneuver™ your body will work better than you imagine and you will know the rest can be accomplished consistently -- rather than empty promises that only work for some.
Posted by: slamo28
« on: May 02, 2017, 12:11:04 am »


Was there anything that helped you adjust to sleeping exclusively on your back, or was it just a situation of forcing yourself to do it until it was natural? I practically sleep on my face, and can see how it'd be a huge challenge to lay flat up.

So this is something i've been think a lot about. My first attempts at sleeping on my back failed and that was because my muscles were so used to curling up into a ball. So for those who feel major discomfort i suggest stretching hip flexors before bed. I went to the absolute extreme and released every single trigger point in my body. This was in hopes to fully lengthen any atrophied muscles to assuage back sleeping process. Man lemme tell you, i found trigger points ALL OVER especially in the quadriceps. There was a trigger point i found that swelled to the size of a golf ball. I even stopped goin to the gym because i didnt want to add any excess tension. Anyway the goal is to really loosen up hip flexors and get rid of any anteriror pelvic tilt. Or any pelvic tilt for that matter. I would also focus on pecotralis minor and major as that can greatly affect posture. Like seriously do not over look those. I would refer to this website to tackle the big six areas of your body. This website changed my life seriously. http://www.ptacademy.edu.au/ultimate-six-unlock-your-body/


I find sleep apnea and heavy snoring unavoidable when sleeping on back, even after using pillows to elevate the head and neck.


for those who literally cant sleep on their backs because of airways issues, continue mewing, doing oral posture exercises three times a day. We want that palate to widen and that lower jaw to come forward so that your tongue wont obstruct your airway. In the mean time you will have to elevate your upper body using a wedge pillow as that will alleviate those airway issues. 


It seems that even Native Americans - whose skulls neared perfection - didn't sleep without a pillow. Yet considering the evolution of the modern human it should be reasonable to assume that man spent majority of this lengthy period sleeping without a pillow, especially before becoming self-aware enough to start utilizing complex tools. All animals in the nature have their own proper growth ensuring natural sleeping positions that can be achieved without any extra props. It wouldn't make sense to believe that the modern human would've evolved to need a pillow for sleep either. Instead, it was probably something that was picked up over time to compensate for improper structure and form.

Yes exactly!
Posted by: PaperBag
« on: May 01, 2017, 11:46:18 pm »

Yea this is all you need for the crane. Also, strangely im not surprised there are no before and after pics. The crane needs to be worn at night and i know for a fact peoples sleep habits are poor already. The lady i talked to said one has to teach his or herself to sleep on their back for this treatment to work. for the average person who curls up into a ball at night, sleeping on their back will most likely be so uncomfortable that they say **** it and give up. Throw a crane in the mix and forget it. BUT my hypothesis is once someone fixes their head posture and can sleep on their back without ANY PILLOWS (which i have done), the crane should would perfectly. Anyone who has the crane, is this wishful thinking or does this sound practical?

Was there anything that helped you adjust to sleeping exclusively on your back, or was it just a situation of forcing yourself to do it until it was natural? I practically sleep on my face, and can see how it'd be a huge challenge to lay flat up.
Posted by: Progress
« on: May 01, 2017, 01:14:21 pm »

BUT my hypothesis is once someone fixes their head posture and can sleep on their back without ANY PILLOWS (which i have done), the crane should would perfectly. Anyone who has the crane, is this wishful thinking or does this sound practical?

I agree that with correctly forward grown bone structure it should be possible, and perhaps even optimal. Do you find it easy to breathe while sleeping on your back without a pillow? I find sleep apnea and heavy snoring unavoidable when sleeping on back, even after using pillows to elevate the head and neck.

It seems that even Native Americans - whose skulls neared perfection - didn't sleep without a pillow. Yet considering the evolution of the modern human it should be reasonable to assume that man spent majority of this lengthy period sleeping without a pillow, especially before becoming self-aware enough to start utilizing complex tools. All animals in the nature have their own proper growth ensuring natural sleeping positions that can be achieved without any extra props. It wouldn't make sense to believe that the modern human would've evolved to need a pillow for sleep either. Instead, it was probably something that was picked up over time to compensate for improper structure and form.
Posted by: slamo28
« on: May 01, 2017, 11:17:22 am »

A modified retainer would be preferable, if that could be used instead of the ALF. I couldn't confirm it because there wasn't a whole lot of info, but I thought I heard that ALF requires those headgear posts (whatever the correct term is) bonded around your teeth?

The Crane employee I emailed didn't reply when I asked if there's any more patient before/after photos besides X-rays, which was very disappointing considering the "years of testing" their site proclaims.


Yea this is all you need for the crane. Also, strangely im not surprised there are no before and after pics. The crane needs to be worn at night and i know for a fact peoples sleep habits are poor already. The lady i talked to said one has to teach his or herself to sleep on their back for this treatment to work. for the average person who curls up into a ball at night, sleeping on their back will most likely be so uncomfortable that they say **** it and give up. Throw a crane in the mix and forget it. BUT my hypothesis is once someone fixes their head posture and can sleep on their back without ANY PILLOWS (which i have done), the crane should would perfectly. Anyone who has the crane, is this wishful thinking or does this sound practical?
Posted by: PaperBag
« on: April 30, 2017, 11:42:16 pm »

A modified retainer would be preferable, if that could be used instead of the ALF. I couldn't confirm it because there wasn't a whole lot of info, but I thought I heard that ALF requires those headgear posts (whatever the correct term is) bonded around your teeth?

The Crane employee I emailed didn't reply when I asked if there's any more patient before/after photos besides X-rays, which was very disappointing considering the "years of testing" their site proclaims.

Trying to attach the photo keeps bringing up a message saying "the upload folder is full", so here it is:
Posted by: slamo28
« on: April 30, 2017, 12:01:10 pm »

Let us know what he says. One ortho i called had different rates for different services. He said $625 for him to oversee the entire crane treatment, and another amount (he didnt say) for them to just provide it along with modified retainers.

Do you mean retainers related to the Crane treatment? I emailed the Crane people a few days ago asking if a retainer is used for pulling with the Crane and they said the suggested appliance was a reverse pull version of ALF. (I'm trying to attach a photo of it, but keep getting an error message)

yes i do mean retainers related the Cranee. they told me i could use a retainer with hooks attached to it. But yea the usually use ALF. really wanna see that phot. if your pulling image from a website then right click, copy image location, click insert image right below BOLD button, then paste image location in between prompt.
Posted by: PaperBag
« on: April 30, 2017, 12:15:18 am »

Let us know what he says. One ortho i called had different rates for different services. He said $625 for him to oversee the entire crane treatment, and another amount (he didnt say) for them to just provide it along with modified retainers.

Do you mean retainers related to the Crane treatment? I emailed the Crane people a few days ago asking if a retainer is used for pulling with the Crane and they said the suggested appliance was a reverse pull version of ALF. (I'm trying to attach a photo of it, but keep getting an error message)
Posted by: slamo28
« on: April 29, 2017, 12:53:32 pm »


Lastly, what appliance do we think is more effective? CP got results using a bulky acrylic palate expander, and I already have one of those (but not yet a treatment plan), but I like the idea of the ALF because it's constant and can be paired with myofunctional therapy which is better in the long run.

I would probably go with the ALF so that you can practice proper oral posture while undergoing treatment. Although any expander is good just make sure you practice myofunctional therapy directly after treatment.

 
GuysI will propose to my ortho to use Crane on me, wish me good luck and if he does agree (and I do not live in any capital or big city) well it could be taken as living example of the fact that is not necessary to travel worldwide to have a Crane treatment done. Fly in America is like madness for someone who lives in any other part of the world. Tons of money..

Let us know what he says. One ortho i called had different rates for different services. He said $625 for him to oversee the entire crane treatment, and another amount (he didnt say) for them to just provide it along with modified retainers. 
Posted by: MeltedFace
« on: April 28, 2017, 11:14:42 pm »

Hi! No expert advice but I do appreciate the video - it's really encouraging :)
Posted by: MJON
« on: April 28, 2017, 12:23:53 pm »

Skull I understand, no disputing she looks better in the second picture though, so obviously the face pulling has worked!
Slamo28 I've looked into the Crane and the neck brace seems real bulky, I was hoping to wear any face pulling appliance overnight but I doubt I'd be able to with that. I know the guy on facpulling.com has made his own but I'm not sure if I have to skills for that.
I see what you mean about the mandible as well, I think she should have carried on face pulling with something that didnt push the lower jaw and perhaps at a more forward angle, as this would have fixed the gummy smile which is a sign of a recessed maxilla I believe?
I'm hoping to book an assessment with an orthodontist in these next coming months to begin treatment.. I'm not 100% sure my reading is accurate but my interior molar width is 30mm which I believe is small considering I have 28 teeth?
Lastly, what appliance do we think is more effective? CP got results using a bulky acrylic palate expander, and I already have one of those (but not yet a treatment plan), but I like the idea of the ALF because it's constant and can be paired with myofunctional therapy which is better in the long run. I'm considering using ALF to expand then once expanded have braces (maybe damon for even more axpansion?) and facepull whilst having braces with my palate expandre, or even whilst wearing the ALF.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYJBkX9FTLQ video of results with homeoblock
Any advice would be great guys :)
Posted by: Progress
« on: April 27, 2017, 12:19:49 pm »

Ah yeah, I misunderstood the issue you were talking about. I thought that by talking about anchoring you were referring to the pulling force that is anchored to the braces/appliance on the upper dental arch.

Yes, that may be an issue, at least for children whose bones are still very malleable.